The One Ring
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Sunlight in Mazarbul
http://www.one-ring.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=25997		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Erurainon the Trombonist [ Sun Jun 02, 2013 10:59 pm ]
Post subject:  Sunlight in Mazarbul
In the FotR film, would the cave troll not have been turned to stone by the beam of sunlight in the Chamber of Mazarbul? Just a little observation.
Author:  JamesR [ Mon Jun 03, 2013 12:33 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Sunlight in Mazarbul
I don't think so because the trolls in the Hobbit were "mountain" not "cave" so there are differences, plus it's indirect light so I think they can get away with it lol.
Author:  Fëanor, the mighty elf [ Mon Jun 03, 2013 6:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Sunlight in Mazarbul
It should have turned into stone, yes. The only Trolls in the Lord of the Rings (the books that is) that could withstand the sunlight, were the Olog-hai, a breed of Trolls created/improved by Sauron in Dol Guldur and Mordor. It would be possible for the Olog-hai to inhabit Moria, but I don't think so personally.
By the way note that in the books it was not a monstrous Troll that stabbed Frodo, but a still pretty intimidating man-sized Orc Chieftain.
I'm not sure about the indirect light argument. I think it was written that Trolls turned into stone in daylight, and so in that case it doesn't matter if it is indirect sunlight or not.

Then again, also the Orcs should have been much weaker during the day... :?
Author:  Erurainon the Trombonist [ Mon Jun 03, 2013 7:00 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Sunlight in Mazarbul
Fëanor, the mighty elf wrote:
By the way note that in the books it was not a monstrous Troll that stabbed Frodo, but a still pretty intimidating man-sized Orc Chieftain.


Yes, I knew about the lack of troll in the book. A least it wasn't an oversight on Tolkien's part! :)
Author:  Delirivm [ Fri Jun 07, 2013 11:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Sunlight in Mazarbul
There was a cave troll in the book iirc but it was indeed a huge orc-chieftain (almost man-sized) who stabbed Frodo.
Author:  ElfLover [ Fri Jun 07, 2013 11:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Sunlight in Mazarbul
In the book there were actually multiple cave trolls but when one of them shoved his foot past the doorway Frodo shouted, "FOR THE SHIRE!" and stabbed his foot with sting making him run away. :)
Author:  Fëanor, the mighty elf [ Sat Jun 08, 2013 7:45 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Sunlight in Mazarbul
ElfLover wrote:
In the book there were actually multiple cave trolls but when one of them shoved his foot past the doorway Frodo shouted, "FOR THE SHIRE!" and stabbed his foot with sting making him run away. :)

Actually, just to nitpick ;), there was 1 Troll or maybe more, Gandalf wasn't sure:

Quote:
'There are Orcs, very many of them,' he said. `And some are large and evil: black Uruks of Mordor. For the moment they are hanging back, but there is something else there. A great cave-troll, I think, or more than one. There is no hope of escape that way.'

The Fellowship of the Ring - The Bridge of Khazad-dum

Also interesting to note in this passage is a bit later the description of the cave-troll. He had green scales, toe-less feet and black blood. Quite different from the movie cave-troll, I'd say. Also Boromir's hew at the scaled arm was futile and in fact even dented his sword!
Author:  Delirivm [ Sat Jun 08, 2013 9:32 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Sunlight in Mazarbul
Yep.
There were possibly multiple cave-trolls, but only one is described.
Boromir's sword had a dent after he hew at the troll and Frodo managed to pierce the foot.
It was huge orc-chieftain that stabbed Frodo.
These are the facts ^^

Do trolls turn into stone in daylight or direct sunlight?
And I don't think a troll actually entered the room, so it's safe to say no troll stepped into the beam of light... I guess :D
Author:  Fëanor, the mighty elf [ Sat Jun 08, 2013 10:20 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Sunlight in Mazarbul
On the topic of Trolls turning into stone, we only have one actual description of it actually happening, as far as I know.

Quote:
"Dawn take you all, and be stone to you!" said a voice that sounded like William's. But it wasn't. For just at that moment the light came over the hill, and there was a mighty twitter in the branches. William never spoke for he stood turned to stone as he stooped; and Bert and Tom were stuck like rocks as they looked at him. And there they stand to this day, all alone, unless the birds perch on them; for trolls, as you probably know, must be underground before dawn, or they go back to the stuff of the mountains they are made of, and never move again. That is what had happened to Bert and Tom and William.

The Hobbit, Roast Mutton

For this passage we can conclude that trolls turn into stone by daylight. From the first emphasized part, it isn't clear whether it was direct sunlight, or just daylight that 'hit' them, but from the seconds emphasized part, it is clear that it is just the light of day (from what I can make of it, to be exact: direct or indirect light of the sun between dawn and sunset).

Now it is interesting to wonder what happens if Frodo's troll would have stepped into the daylight of the Chamber of Mazarbul. Would he have been petrified as he was 'hit' by the light of day, or would he have remained alive as he was underground (which they have to be to remain alive, according to this passage)...
Author:  DurinsBane [ Sun Jun 09, 2013 8:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Sunlight in Mazarbul
Quote:
It should have turned into stone, yes


Actually you are wrong, there is one crucial piece of evidence that you missed from the scene...
The Cave Troll would not of turned to stone...because he was wearing Legolas as a parasol.
Author:  Fëanor, the mighty elf [ Sun Jun 09, 2013 9:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Sunlight in Mazarbul
DurinsBane wrote:
Quote:
It should have turned into stone, yes


Actually you are wrong, there is one crucial piece of evidence that you missed from the scene...
The Cave Troll would not of turned to stone...because he was wearing Legolas as a parasol.

Oh, of course, yes. Or maybe you could step in and block all the light with your metaphorical wings? :P
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