One more thing, and sure, we'll leave it there.

Pg. 162 makes reference to the section "There are Nine...", not to the epic hero ringwraith entry, which is in fact only the first half of pg. 163. Even the Ringwraith entry on pg. 163 references the below section of rules as if it was a separate rules entry.

To further differentiate the Ringwraith from the Winged Nazgul, the Winged Nazgul does not have access to any epic actions. In no way is a Winged Nazgul to be interpreted as an epic hero, not can the Ringwraith part of it move to another formation.

Epic heroes from pg. 163 does not mean Legendary Formations from pg. 162.

But all right, let's not get heated over anything as silly as rules. For my part, I hope GW produces a FAQ quick enough, and that it doesn't sound like the last Warhammer FAQ I read.

OK, try as hard as I might, I can't agree that Winged Nazgul can be included in Fallen Realms/Angmar armies. Unless you follow the standard procedure for allies. This seems strange as you could field the Witch-king as a Winged Nazgul, although he would not be the leader.


The wording reads -



Page 163 is the entry for Ringwraith.

A Ringwraith is an Epic Hero. (Single model)



So, the reference to Epic Heroes means a Ringwraith.

A Winged Nazgul is a Legendary Formation. (Single model)




The box-out is poorly written, as, technically, there is no such model as a Nazgul. The entry is Winged Nazgul...

Now, the Winged Nazgul are Legendary Formations, not Epic Heroes. They do not have Epic Actions.

In the profile for Sauron (in both guises), Gulavhar, Buhrdur (whom, as they are mounted on 40mm or larger bases are Legendary Formations) etc, under the Epic Actions text, it is written



So, there is an obvious distinction between an Epic Hero and a Legendary Formation. A Legendary Formation consisting of a single model on a 40mm base is considered a Hero, but not an Epic Hero. As the Winged Nazgul entry does not include this line of text, it cannot be classed as an Epic Hero, meaning that they are not covered by the wording of the rule.



The problem here is that the term Ringwraith is used to mean two things.

In it's singular form (Ringwraith) it means the Epic Hero.

As a plural (Ringwraiths) it is used to refer to the 9 Black Riders. OR more than 1 Epic Hero Ringwraith...

Essentially, there are 9 Black Riders, which may be chosen as either a Ringwraith or a Winged Nazgul. Each can only be chosen once, but, they can take either form.

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Saruman the White is the good Saruman. He has access to the Spells of Command, Dismay, and Ruin. Saruman the White Hand is evil. He has access to the Spells of Command and Ruin. In the Rulebook, it states the spells of Dismay are used only seldomly by good-doers, but things of evil revel in them. If this is true, why does the Evil Saruman (The White Hand) not have access to these evil spells of Dismay? In SBG I know that Saruman could use Terrifying Aura (A spell of Dismay) because I saw it in a battle report. Please clarify why Evil people cannot use Evil spells.

Evil people CAN use evil spells.

An Uruk-hai Shaman has the spells of Ruin.




A Mordor Orc Shaman has the Spells of Darkness.



An Angmar Orc Shaman has the Spells of Dismay.



Those 'beings of good heart' are Saruman the White, Gandalf (in his various guises), Galadriel, The White Council, and the Council of Wizardry.

The reason that Saruman the White Hand cannot use the Spells of Dismay, is because he is not Saruman the White. They are two separate profiles that represent Saruman at different times during the War of the Ring.

I.E - Saruman the White is when he is a member of the White Council, before he openly begins searching for the One Ring. He has already secretly started though, hence the Spells of Dismay.

Saruman the White Hand is after his true intentions have been revealed. Consider that at this point, he has his Uruk-hai army, and is openly waging war, rather than using his previous attempts at subterfuge.

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Hi Guys,
I am new at your forum as a registered one but I was a visitor here before. I found that topic and I found it really helpful in case of playing WotR in the close future. I am from Poland so I'd like to post here some of the cases that me and my friends find while reading the WotR rulerbook. In case that they were mantioned before don't bother to anwser I hope that my english will be communicative and everyone will understand me. In any case I will try my best


The first one is that some of the spells don't have the time period of time in which they are acctive e.g. like the Dark Fury or Pall of Night. The first one give us rerolling the 1s and 2s when rolling to hit, and the second stop the formations from charing(also adding the worst shooting value). Because they don't have the time of staying in game written they are just to powerful. In a case of Pall of Night there is a counterspell but still it can to easy stop many of the many units from play.

The another one of my questions is about the natural 1 on D6. In most of the GW games rolling the one means failing to hit but there isn't any information about it in the WotR ruler book. Does it mean thet the company included Gil Galad, Aragorn and Elendil(costs many post but still possible to field) always hit

Next question is about the "Overlord" rule. Here are two doubts. The first one is that doeas the company that want to use the Ovelord Might has to hace Might points of its own. The rules means thet "can use the Ovelord Might rather then their own" which is suggesting that it has to have, but on the other hand in one of the GW website articles about the WotR we can find the information that Saruman can "borrow" his Might points to the Berseker company that doesn't have Might points on its own.
The second point is about the equivalence of the Heroic and Epic actions. Can another hero use the Overlord Might to perform epic actions. I don't so, but the rulerbook doesn't give us clear anwser. The overlord rules states that we can perform Heroic Actions, but the Epic action's section states that the epic actions are treated in the same way as the heroic ones.

That all that I can remind in that moment, but of course I will update it when I'll find sth new.

Good point about magic, it doesn't say either way how lonf some spells last, I just assumed all spells lasted for the duration of the turn, and as you say, some are to strong if they do and for that reason I stick to my original instinct.

There is not rule that say's a one is alway's a miss, whether they forgot to put it in, I don't know. Either way if somebody decides to field Aragorn and Elendil etc to get an uatomaatic hit, deserve an automatic hit on the nose himself :p

Overlord? No idea, rules are not clear.

Yeah, but still it won't be to difficult to find such a players who won't agree with you, and unfortunatly in a source(kill me but I hate idioms in english and I never know if I use them in the correct way ) of rulerbook they will be right. And that's why that should be specify in the future FAQ.



That a good point, but I'am prety sure that someday I will find myself in a play with such a player.

Regarding Spells -


It would seem that, unless countered or the description states otherwise, spells last for the remainder of the game.

For example, Spells of Command, Aura of Blinding light - 'lasts until the end of the turn.'

Spells of Ruin - Shatter Shields - 'receives no Defence bonus for their shields for the remainder of the turn... On a roll of 6,... no benefit for their sheilds for the rest of the game.'


Also, read the Epic Heroes and Spell Interaction box out on pg. 72. It would suggest that spells remain in play.




Regarding 1+ Shoot values.


Two things suggest that a roll is required.

1. Box out on pg 40 -



If a 1+ Shoot value did not require a roll, it would be written as 'Auto'.

2. In WD, Mat Ward talks about not liking guaranteed things in gaming, hence the inclusion of the random charge distance. That would suggest that, as with other GW games, a To Hit roll of 1 is an automatic failure.

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Studio gaarew; Gaming armies, by gamers, for gamers.

Well Gil-Galad and Elendil would be themeable, giving a +4 (if it stacks of which I'm not sure)

A thing I was wondering: scenario Disaster at the Gladden Fields
"No epic heroes or legendary formations may be fielded"
followed by it's perfectly legitable to draft in some darker creatures like Black Numenoreans or The Castellans of Dol Guldur to represent the leaders of the warband

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It's not about our past.
It's about our future.

Another few questions about my army(Mordor)

The Dark Marshal got a special rule "Rule through Fear".
Suppose that we have a formation of orcs charged by sth with the terror rule. They fail theit courage test and have their fight value reduced to 0. Can I still rise it by "borrowing" the Dark Marshal's
And also what if the hero in formation which is "borrowing" fight value from Dark Marshal fight in a herois duel. Is he using his fight value or the Marshal's one

Hi, you should really start a new thread for your rules questions as this is a thread for errors, anyway...

A Company alway's uses the heroes Fight, so their fight becomes say 5 instead of 3. Now, if the company has its Fight reduced, then its Fight value is still reduced regardless of what it started at whether it be 5 or 3.

I don't know the answer to the second question and it is an important one as it has reprecussions on Hero-monsters, that would make them extremely vulnerable to Heroic Duels - they would alway's lose! So I'd say that Heroic Duels are not effected by Fight loss unless specifically specified in the rules.

Re-read the question, my general answer still stands but additionally, a hero does not use another heroes Fight value.

ehya just noticed something though i dont know if its an error or not but sauron does not have the special rule overlord yet the rule is called OVERLORD and sauron is specificly mentioned in the rules description

I know, that I should start a new tread, but that is the last one, so bear with me
But look, my fight is reduced in the charge phase cause I have to pass(or not) the courage test immediatly after being charged by "terrorist". And the Marshal's special rule is used at the beginning of the fight phase. Is it still like you said

In that case, I'd say the Marshall ability would counter the Terror effect as his ability was the last one used.

In the big battle report near the back of the book it says that citadel guard are rare,but in the army list part it says they are common

cheers
matt

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Good heavens,it seems my wee-wee is suffering from rigour mortis

Both Boromir (p 103) and Lurtz (p 178) have the Mighty Blow special rule. however, in the description for Boromir's Mighty Blow, it says the special ability only counts for the hits he makes, whilst for Lurtz it says it counts for his company.

anyone think this is a typo for Boromir? shouldn't the rule count for his whole company?

just a small typo, although it doesn't really change the implication, you can guess the missing word is 'phase'

Page 198. Special Rule: 'The crew'.

'the crew of the mumak may shoot in the shoot.'

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[url=http://one-ring.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=50&p=298502#p298502]Corsair's WIP Thread - 03 Dec 12 Update[/url]

I don't agree with that line of thought in regards to what spells he should have lost/kept during that transition.
I think it stands to reason that GW made a typo, writing Command instead of Dismay on Saruman the White Hand, because:
1) Gandalf and Radagast, along with plenty of elves (Galadriel, Celeborn, Elrond and Cirdan), knows all the Spells of Command.
Saruman the White was a wizard of good faction and knew all the Spells of Command (along with Dismay and Ruin)
No evil wizards know any Spells of Command (apart from Saruman).

2) Plenty of evil wizards know Spells of Dismay, Sauron and Ringwraiths among others, and it doesn't get any more evil than those...
Only 3 good faction wizards know them, and Saruman the White being one (Gandalf and Galadriel the others, although I may have missed someone)

Going from Good to Evil, why would Saruman not loose the "Good" spells of Command instead of the "Evil" spells of Dismay. I can't really see him using magic such as "Blessing of the Valar" or "Instil Valour", let alone have them instead of "Visions of Woe" or "Terrifying Aura".

I mean I'd love to be able to bring back Berserkers with "Blessing of the Valar", but it just doesn't feel right.
In the SBG, as far as I can tell, he seems a lot closer to Dismay (with Terrifying Aura + Transfix (basically the same Immobolise as in the SBG, not the watered down version in spells of Command)).

Imo we should all be playing with Saruman the White Hand as Ruin+Dismay.

Good news for all the War of the rings players:
I talked yesterday with Alesio Cavatore and he told me that Games Workshop had finished a FAQ for War of the ring and that i will be soon on their website.

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Mea govannon.

I recall a similar statement given by Allesio years ago about other FAQs as well.

Regardless of my cynicism, I hope its true. This sucker is going to need a few more pages than what other GW games typically get. A section for rules and a section for the armies....